The RWC

Who cares? I mean I really don't.

The All Blacks will win.. big w00p easy win the other teams were complete shit so it was handed to them on a plate really. France are useless.

lame.

*channeling my inner nutcase talk back caller*

i care.

And no.. not all the other teams have been shit, they just look that way when we play them because the AB's are playing so well at the moment.

I hate rugby, but Wales were fucking awesome!!

I think my grumble is more with how town is atm.. trying to go for a dance anywhere is just a nightmare Saturday night was insane.

Plus, I think you should care, as I believe the nations mental health is at stake here.
Normally I couldnt give a flying rats arse bout it, but I feel this is different. Are you bummed cause all the foreigners have gone home?
You were, as I recall in my very foggy memory, quite excited when it all began.

Yeah I was went to opening night and everything and went to the cloud heaps.. maybe too much too soon and now I just want the clubs back to normal haha

Couldn't care less about the sporting side - the rest has been interesting...

I really do not care. I wouldn't know who is doing what if it weren't for all the facebook status updates whenever a game is on (which is also how I know a game is on).

I've thought better about posting that I still don't give a toss on fb though.

What, there has been LOADS of great games, and I'm not what you would call a rugby nut by ay stretch of the imagination. Dance at home in your underwear. Way better imo.

Fair enough if you do not care, I respect that.

The truth is Rugby is part of our national identity. The All Blacks are the greatest team in the history of sports (yes that's right). While Rugby means a lot to me, this tournament has been great for NZ publicity, great for Rugby and has lifted the national mood in the wake of some dark times.

I will support the All Blacks forever win or lose, the way they have played and rolled with the punches this tournament is admirable. There are great role models in Ritchie McCaw, Brad Thorn and the older guys. So while it's fair to say you don't care, respect that it does mean a lot to a lot of people in this country

Plenty of clubs not packed to the gunnels with douches and rugby boofheads. Go to them instead.

Excellent post resist

I was going to suggest this

I'm loving it now. I got tired of rugby after being surrounded by it ALL THE TIME (same with netball).
But the world cup has got me waving my pom poms again and it's rad.

Plus I'm now president of the AC is cute fan club

I've never watched so much rugby in my life and I'm loving it. Last night's game was kickass! If you get into it, it's exciting and fun and makes you feel happy and tingly when the AB's do well

Yeah I was like that ...even spent heaps on RWC merchandise at the cloud for me and my kid...Maybe its cos the ABs are too good and I wanted to see a nailbiter not a walk in the park. Oh well no one wants to hears me whining.

I thought it was pretty exciting stuff.

...and we haven't won it yet. There are still the French in our way. Our World Cup Nemesis.

Auckland looks like its going off at the moment!! This is the only time I've really been jealous of not living back home - cant wait to get amongst it this weekend!!

Watching the team bus drive through town and see the people go mental was the first time I've really felt any sort of emotional attachment with the ABs :>

Also choked up a bit when they interviewed McCaw after the game

hate the game, hate the culture... yet am still proud when we win or play well #beingakiwiisconfusing

^^

tbh if anything, it's actually dropped away now with all the teams out, but yeah, still cool atmosphere to be had.


i've said it before and will say it again, you don't have to be into the game or the culture that surrounds it to still enjoy the good party atmosphere around town. hell, in the city it's hard to avoid it.

even my mum is supporting the ABs now,

but for me, I still struggle to have any sort of emotional attachment to the ABs.

The Kiwis for sure, I watched that game screaming and cheering, but the ABs just don't do anything for me.

I got fucked off at those stupid little ewoks dancing around when the second Death Star blew up.
Proud supporter of the Empire I am.

^^

rugger and star wars - two things you'd think could never get confused...

world meet biggie

Unless your in the cloud its shit. Fuck hanging around on the streets like the opening party. Gotta be either watching it live, in a bar with big tv or in the cloud.

Kinda makes sense to have that emotional block there when your own country so regularly face off against the ABs which you won't get with Kiwis, I guess

Totally agree. I am a mad rugby/league/cricket fan so its about the sport, but over and above that its much more about the event itself. Auckland gets about 1 international event every ten years if we're lucky (Com games, Americas cup, RWC) so I think people should just embrace it and have a good time, rugby fan or not.

Can't wait to get back for the weekend. If we win it will be the biggest party NZ has ever seen! Its going to be manic!!!!!

I shall be at Zen on Sunday night for it's last ever gig! Although will no doubt watch the rugby beforehand somewhere.. not sure why but just can't get into Rugby like I do football.. was way more into the All Whites run at the real World Cup last year.

Still, will be awesome if the ABs win on the weekend

The historic rivalry between the Springboks and the All Blacks is strong and well entrenched. I can perfectly understand where gb and Neil are coming from. God knows if I ever moved to Australia, there is no fuckin way I would ever support the Kangaroos, Wallabies or their cricket team but I might support them in say, football. But only against anyone else than the All Whites.

Nicely put.... I love watching rugby and love the attention it helps bring on NZ - either the RWC or the general comments people have made over the years when I've been in random places all over the world. The ABs are a globally recognised and respected sporting ideal.

Don't mind the game, agree on the culture being yuck, and agree that proud they're doing so well...we fucking smashed Aussie, just totally out played them restricted terriroty and possession and it was great to watch...infact, the most I've ever enjoyed watching a game

And as has been said, we have not won yet, France have a nasty habit of fucking our shit up late in the tournament...don't count the embryos before the gestation period has ended

I'm genuinely curious as to what you lot think the 'rugby culture' is in this country?

If you think it can be narrowed to some shirtless, beer swilling jock in a top 40 bar, I'd say you're well off the mark.

Please clarify.



gc.

if you think thats what we feel is rugby culture you're way off the mark

saying that I don't intend writing a long version of what I perceive as rugby culture for I've not the time nor inclination

in short - male dominated, macho tough guy RUGBY IS god sorta stuff - crosses all "classes" and is displayed in slightly different variations accordingly - the way the game is treated as it and those involved are the most important thing in the nation is tiresome (and insulting to all of us who have other interests and desires for ourselves and the country as a whole)... the culture is well past its use by date but fights a heroic rear guard action for now

Not an easy question. One way to answer is to identify an ideal type (much like a stereotype), a kind of archaetypal kiwi rugby supporter, but you have to recognise that becasue rugby is a part of the national culture, which is increasingly varied, that in real life there is huge variation from the ideal typical case. Another approach would be to identify different segments of the rugby market, which would be characteristed by different attitudes and different levels of committment to the game and to the All Blacks. Quite a complicated exercise. Rugby supporters have changed as NZ culture has become more varied.

My gross over-generalization of rugby culture in NZ leans towards drunk dudes singing the Exponents, calling Norman Cook techno, beating up Star Trek fans, and calling muso's with long hair girls. Off the mark probably, but this is what I noticed growing up in rural middle NZ.

In television promo's here for the NZ vs AUS game, it said "Most children grow up wanting to be in rock bands, but in NZ all children grow up wanting to be a.... ALL BLACK"

Maybe thats what they mean

another way is to look at how Rugby dominates our media landscape.... at the cost of every other sport and news item

look at the herald online (and other places) rugby, rugby, rugby... oil disaster... rugby rugby rugby

its not just how rugby manifests itself in its fans... but how it is pushed at all of us constantly as if we live for nothing else... its sad and pathetic....

LK has summed up a large number of people I've meet and loathed my entire life...

While we are hosting the world cup, it makes sense for rugby to be everywhere, and Ive no problem with that (it's good for the nations collective mental health to be unified for once). However a great example is how my sons high school has an IT suite filled with Macs so old Ive seen calculators with more processing power, a music department with instruments so fucked about all you could play is a one string version of Tom Dooley, but the sports dept has more rugby balls than rebel sports, goal posts that gleam in the morning sun, and rugby uniforms of such pristine condition you'd think they belong in Prince Williams wardrobe.

And I bet he goes to a fairly normal school, not say a rugby MAD school like Kelston or what have you


Pretty much all of the above for me. The slavish worship of rugby over pretty much everything else. The school example is a good one - I couldn't even get a generic school sports jacket or shirt when I went to the secondary schools swim champs, as a national level champion - but 8th grade rugby team? No problems.

Disaster happens? It's ok, some All Blacks are coming to visit. Oh look, one of them is taking a dump! Better get a story up.


And yet, trying to actually get anything out of the various RFU's is like pulling teeth. Here at school, we reach out to similar organisations all the time. Call the netball people? They'll send Silver Ferns out to see you, or Mystics players to run a coaching day. Call the Warriors? They send the Ah Vahn brothers out to spend most of a day running a league skills clinic. Call ARU? They'll send some posters, or maybe if you're lucky, some Under 20's players. Maybe. Anything from the NZRFU? Fuck no, dreaming.

More of an opiate for the masses than religion

Well as normal as you can get in rural NZ. (if that can be considered normal)
"When I leave school I was thinking about becoming a 3d animator"
"Dont be stupid, if you cant pass that ball properly, you will milk cows, or raise sheep like everyone else"

It's the rugby world cup at the moment, the most important sporting event we have hosted in the last 10 years... how often do you see all blacks stories on the front page any other time apart from the 4-6 matches of the Tri-Nations every year ?

We are 1 win off being World Champions at our national sport, it deserves some press.

All the time?

Edit: It's not just about the All Blacks either.

Whether the haters like it or not, the ABs are the one aspect of NZ culture that dominates the world in their respective domain... I'm no rugby-head but that's something to admire.

my point re media stills stands - I appreciate its the RWC, and what a big deal that is.... and that it is obviously going to dominate the media... but it also dominates our media much of the rest of the year and has my entire life

I do admit one can easily ignore rugby these days thanks largely to multiple media and the country growing up and moving on from our one dimensional selves plus there is ones ability to choose what we expose ourselves to (I don't watch TV news)

who decides what our national sport is?

The 56.5%* of the nation who actually care about Rugby bob ?

* Taken from a peer reviewed article.

EDIT: we have a long history with rugby are we just supposed to turn our backs on that and suddenly start supporting new sports?

Yoinked from someone's share on FB - supposedly stuff's website on monday, run through a script to remove rugby references;


I enjoy watching rugby and of course it will get attention during the world cup, but the way it dominates the media at the expense of other sports (and currently at the expense of other news at all) pisses me off. I admit this is more a problem with the media than the game/rugby culture itself perhaps.

tbh, rugby's domination of the media has decreased steadily over the years imo...

Nobody really gives a fuck about the S15 and NPC anymore.

Friday nights game is going to be really interesting!!

White mans has a long history of oppressing niggers, are we just supposed to turn our backs on that too? What a stupid strawman.

Comparing racism to sports is strawman.

not when discussing rugby's impact on our nation...



wiki about the Olympic Games

I think there is often a lot of resentment towards the sport, based on the fact that it is the dominant sporting culture in New Zealand. 'Rugby' itself is much less important, I believe, than the All Blacks brand. The All Blacks are an iconic sporting brand, known the world over. Rugby is now a genuinely global game, and though it may not be as ubiquitously popular as Soccer, it would be foolish to suggest that it's merely an isolated game played by bullies and jocks. The All Blacks are the pinnacle of this global game, and we expect a lot from them. And for the most part, they deliver. They shape role models who command respect on the field and off it, and many of the game's past characters have embodied the overal feeling of the nation's men at any given snippet of our history.

Over the decades we have chosen (albeit fairly passively in many cases) to lay our collective identity hat on the 'Blacks'. This has translated through to a much broader sense of national identity that is also tied in with things like the Haka, the Silver Fern on a black flag and embracing black as our national sporting identity. If the team doesn't have some derivative name (Black Caps, Black Sticks etc) then they play/perform in black. This is all to do with the All Blacks.

Discussions like this are really just about how important people believe sport is to a nation's psyche. In New Zealand we have rugby, because we are the best in the world at it. THAT is how it becomes our national sport. The rugby culture is an extension of national pride for many (clearly not all), just like football is in Brazil, or Manchester... or American Football is in Dallas... or cricket is in India. There are many sociological benefits to sport participation and sport, and NZ if you don't like the ABs, then you should at least be able to acknowledge its importance to other people, and not fob it off as the sole domain of gormless thugs.

Anyway, I still believe it is more about the All Blacks than the game itself. I am a hugely passionate All Blacks fan, but you won't catch me watching a S15 or NPC game more than once or twice a season. And what's wrong with getting behind the All Black machine? The hosting of this RWC, and the popularity of our boys in black are positive advertisements for this country. Complaining about it is one thing, but denying its inherent importance to a VERY wide variety of people is just flat out stupid. I'd contest anyone that could name a demographic or sub culture that still didn't have a few bubbling ABs fans in their midst.



gc.

I don't think anyone is foolish enough to deny rugby's impact on our culture... the application of the phrase rugby racing and beer was for a reason

I would wager that this cultural dominance will decline slowly but surely as we become less one mindset and acknowledge and treasure the plethora of other things we excel in on the world stage (and home) - though nothing will probably ever attain the same blind loyalty as The All Blacks and the weirdness that entails

I still find it incredible that 20 nations withdrew from the Olympics because of a New Zealand sports team. So crazy.

Sorry dude but you do not get to define what is and isn't weird in this context. Those in the minority can disagree all they like, but being in that minority means you are, in fact, the weird one. And in the greater sporting context the same applies in any sporting or mainstream culture.



gc.

I'm not really one for national pride anyway, but there is something a bit tragic to me that goddamn sports team of all things is "important to the national psych."

Tell that to the New Orleans Saints. (Yes not national I know but may as well be size for size).

Or the Springbok's circa 1995.

Why do you hate sports so much? :p

spergin' dude...

i find my blind devotion to the All Blacks a little weird and quite uncharacteristic - but its there in my Kiwi blood and I cant deny it.

haha :>
I used to hate sport but then again I was never sporty. Still not interested in watching sports, it's a bit boring. But enough about me.

I do rather dislike the amount of importance that is placed on it. It's hard to say that and not be misunderstood because in some ways sport is very important. Play is important and hell, it should be what we're all about in life. Play with people and team spirit & all that... And the physical aspect, fitness, health etc.
But it's not important in some of the ways that it is made important. And now all that shit that us non-boofhead people hate has been successfully commercialised and branded, it's even more sickening. I dunno, my thoughts were kind of summed up in the first few posts of the thread answering smf's initial question. But I really don't care about the All Blacks and the RWC, but I admit I've made it a bit of my identity so aside from not caring VERY MUCH I'm also wilfully not caring AT ALL.

That said, if I somehow found myself with the right people, in front of the right game and had the right drinks, I could probably grudgingly have fun :p

I'm pretty sure most people could find enjoyment in most sport if they actually put a bit of effort into understanding the game.

There's a few sports that suck as spectator sports, but most team sports are enjoyable to watch

haha gosh I'm a douche sometimes I really am now excited about Sunday I was just grumpy because I couldn't go out dancing and pretty much everyone I was with was all grumpy cos of the packedness of clubs. Now we have decorated our office and it's all exciting again W00p!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is the likelyhood of the AB's winning on Sunday? I watched the game where they previously creamed France in this tournament... have France improved.

France are a wildcard team, if they turn up to play it could be interesting, if we get the same team that has been shuffling their way through the finals then it should be a blackout.

Accurate probablity is as always easily seen by checking the odds. 8-1 or so. Caution be damned I really give France little chance, and personally think we are even shorter than that

good post smf, I started something similair but got frustrated trying to be as eloquent and gave up. If you travel overseas and mention you are from NZ, invariably the 1st thing people mention is "The All Blacks"...rugby isnt even close to my fav sport but its good to have something we are known to excel at

I dont think it matters if the sport we exceled at anyway, the gumbys and nerds would still be haters b/c of the fear and resentment they still feel from that time a member of the 1st 15 pushed them over at P.E

Personally I was obsessed with rugby as a kid even though I could only play casually. My asthma was too severe to participate in a team. My interest in following the All Blacks lasted until around the time of the 81 Springbok Tour when I was 15. For a lot of people at that time rugby culture became something to hate, and after then my interest in the All Blacks was never the same. It's waxed and waned for various reasons. I still take an interest and enjoy watching occasionally, but its nothing like what it used to be. I'm not hugely moved if they win or loose, play badly or well. The RWC has sparked something that will probably fade until the next.

I bet

Oh and haha, I was thinking of putting a bet on the AB's to win, but at $1.09 odds I don't think I'll bother. Not worth risking $100 to make $9. I'll drink that $9 in the first 10 mins of the game.

PS I've never put a sports bet on before in my life.

New Zealand 13+ $1.47 hmmmmmm

I went to a Rugby School, maybe not as hard out as some other schools.. but with a ex all black as a teacher, and a couple of Tongan imports who's sole purpose was just to play rugby and didn't even have to turn up to class.. we did pretty well

Some of the teachers didn't pay much attention to you unless you were in a rugby team.. and i think most of the prefects played rugby. I was more into surfing/skating, and didn't like the rugby or nothing attitude some of the teachers had, but was friends with most of the 1st xv so didn't hold any grudges.

But i only really started getting into watching national and international rugby about 5 years ago.

If anyone had a reason to hate rugby its me. 1st day of College and PE ....the PE teachers who were both mad rugger heads, asked the class "do any of you poofters play soccer?"

Some bastard piped up my name cos I was goalkeep of the intermediate 1st 11, and I was made to stand up and be ridiculed, one of the teachers literally booted me up the bum, then I was made to laps of the gym while everyone else played KingBall. I was also the butt of all jokes from PE tachers that year. So yeah....rugby heads can be pretty fuckwitish...I got over it though ( we also werent allowed a league team until my final year)

Since youre anewb I will advise against this. Not cos I think its a bad bet but bwecause on a game this were you *should REALLY want the AB's to win. A margin bet puts you in a weird headspace. ie when the AB's are 10 points up with 5 to go and happily winding down the clock, you will be frothing at the mouth at the laziness and unfairness of it all *(nd unable to enjpoy the actually outcome)

So then risk $1000 to win $90

Pffft, again my mathmatical brain says no Yak.

and point take Maestro.

I'll just.. you know.. work for money

Heh just makes me laugh gambling n00bs always say stuff like that: it's not 'worth' the small payout. Either your bet has an edge or it doesn't, the size of the stake is irrelevant heh.

Meh I wasn't really in it for the money... and no at those odds I don't think it has an edge.

The size of the stake is of course relevant relative to the pool its being sourced from, IE my back account.

Bet on something like 1st try and/or last try scorer, then you can get your gambol on and not have your overall enjoyment of the game fettered by your degeneracy

go first try dagg

Ya but you were implying that it's not worth it because it's a small payout, not because the edge isn't favourable If you're not concerned with ROI though and just want to add something to the game, just bet on the more random ones like first try scorer, mode of first points, stuff like that Those ones generally have some decent long-odds options

beaten by Maesty

Yeah my high school was a rugby school too even if you could catch a ball you were a prefect. .. didn't have much to do with those guys I pretty much didn't fall in their radar as I wasn't one of those sporty chicks they seemed to like.. just a nerdy party arty girl who wore bare feet or doc boots and flowers in my hair not rugby or boy focussed really .. ANYWAY time has fixed that mishap..
I think we'll win on Sunday it'll be awesome everyone will be happy it'll be like new years vibe and I love that.. so that's something to be happy about. Though Smiley there may be a few people asking for money for the bus etc so might pay to avoid the city

heh

Its good odds too for 1dt try scorer...you can get 9-14 to 1 on any of our superstar backs

I'll be betting on Tony Woodcock though, just cos theres no real strategy to be had on these so I like kitchy punts ie we are playing the French and Woodcock sounds the nmost like a Rooster PLus...he will be aroiund 30-1, so you only need like $5 outlay to score a decent amount, and Woodcock does score tries

THIS THREAD IS NOW OFFICIALLY ALL ABOUT TE GAMBOL <3

So you're saying you can also place a bet on who will get the first try?

I'd put my money on Wepu or Cruden.

I actually liked Rugby as a kid and I enjoyed the 1st RWC and knew the players all that blah... Hold no grudges against anyone for anything, just as an adult I see it all as a bit boofhead. And the fact that sport has it's own segment in the news... there is something wrong with that.

I'm eyeing up the Total Game Score on betfair... 4.9:1 for 21-30 points,l and 3.4:1 for 31-40. Taking both of those would still be a decent shot.

Also it's currently 13.5 : 1 for first scoring play to be a French try, seems high? :o

You can bet on PILES of different options: https://www.tab.co.nz/sport/#game/63773

Fair enough, I was thinking of it in terms of the odds, its just since I had a set amount I was considering wagering ($100) I had already translated those odds into payout value.

Right, now you're just being fucking stupid.

yes I knew that would offend the sensibilities of just about everyone. Ho hum.

It's not really about offending anybody heh. There's nothing wrong with sport and the vast majority of our culture enjoys it on some level; why on earth *shouldn't* it be on the news?!

QTRAROWNED!

Yeah it's not offending anyone, it's just making you look like a dribbling moron.

that's classic.

We need more news coverage of highly endorsed X sports. I cant understand how, being we live on an island, surfing is still considered a slacker activity. Skating, snowboarding etc.. lots and lots of money involved. Go to Oz and whole communities get behind their local surfers, trying to get on the top 40. Over here its a fucking joke. They have to raise their own money to even attempt to get on the ASP tour, let alone making on to the top 40, and we had a guy a few months back own Slater on one of the stop off events!!!