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[quote]
pstu said:
haha, true, yes I do raise pre-flop but then i'm only playing in practice tourneys at the mo. If someone else is betting big i'd be shitting myself as they've probby got pocket pairs.


The power of AKs is two fold:

a) It's the single best drawing hand there is. If you hit a straight, it will be the nut straight (nut = best, btw). If you hit the flush, it will be the nut flush. If you hit a pair, it will be the top pair, and you will have top kicker. And if that wasn't enough:

b) Fold equity. Yes, AKs is technically a worse hand than pocket 4s. But pocket 4s is also a lot more vulnerable. Let's say you raise with pocket 4s from early position to 3 x big blind. Then let's say you get one caller from middle position. I'm on the button with AKs and I re-raise to 12 x bb. What are you going to do now? Wink You've got to be worried that either one of us has you smashed. Most times, any pocket pair up to like 8s or better will fold here. Pocket 9s and 10s may call but fold to any overcards on the flop. And even when you're up against JJ, QQ - you're still 50% to win anyway.

Basically the only thing that can go wrong is running into AA or KK, or losing a 50% shot when some retard has made a bad call Wink
[quote]
Oh and btw, unless other people have folded other random aces or kings behind you, AKs is actually a statistical favourite over hands like 22,33,44,55 anyway... even though the pair is ahead in hand ranking at this point Smile
[quote]
trixytrixer said:
yeah AQ gets you into so much trouble... just ask phil hellmuth LOL! *looks at yaksha*


Fuck yuo Sad
[quote]
did you see his expert limp with 99 in late position letting the SB complete and the bb check?? then the beautiful ten high flop to which he bet folds to a raise face up!! all this with an M of around 9!!!

CLASSIC PHIL HELLMUTH!!!

Pink Winky
[quote]
trixytrixer said:
all this with an M of around 9!!!


What does this mean? Sad

<3 Phil Hellmuth. Always worth checking his performances in HSP for a good laugh Laughing
[quote]
gummi_bear said:
trixytrixer said:
all this with an M of around 9!!!


What does this mean? Sad


M = your total chips / cost of round

cost of round = how much it costs you for one orbit. So one small blind, one big blind and <amount of players> x <ante>..

It's a way of deciding what kind of moves and what kind of play your chip-stack will allow you. Generally an M > 20 is thought of as enough to have room to move (can start playing suited connectors, small pairs out of position etc).. but with an M of less than 10 you basically can't mess arouand..
[quote]
trixytrixer said:
did you see his expert limp with 99 in late position letting the SB complete and the bb check?? then the beautiful ten high flop to which he bet folds to a raise face up!! all this with an M of around 9!!!


Yeah that was totally fucked up Neutral
QQ I can understand, but 99? Ugh.
[quote]
Ahhh, I'm aware of the idea that if you have less than 10 blinds it's time to look for any half deace hand to get your chips in the middle and hope the flop hits you Smile
[quote]
Yaksha said:
Oh and btw, unless other people have folded other random aces or kings behind you, AKs is actually a statistical favourite over hands like 22,33,44,55 anyway... even though the pair is ahead in hand ranking at this point Smile


Cheers Yak, explained brilliantly. Smile
[quote]
god i hope mikey and tiffany michelle FT it! TM in 6th right now with 36 left pretty sick
[quote]
Come on Mikey!

"One time! Come on, hold up just this one time!!!"

Very Happy
[quote]
Yeah, go Mike and TM. We've pretty much run out of pros to root for Razz heh And yeah a fem at the FT would be awesome Smile Is she hot? heh. haven't seen her.
[quote]
yup she's hot as Very Happy
[quote]
fuck its hard to understand what you're saying trixty Sad

Oh well will just have to learn
[quote]
pstu said:
fuck its hard to understand what you're saying trixty Sad

Oh well will just have to learn


haha - it's a jargon heavy game, eh? Some of it still throws me!

Regarding AK, or any play/raise pre-flop, it's really to do with your position on the table in relation to your stack size in relation to the size of the blinds in relation when the blind is going to hit you next and in relation to how your opponents have been playing. Many many factors to think about, position is one of the key ones. If your Under The Gun (left of the big blind, first one to act) you want to only play premium hands as the whole table is yet to call/fold/raise and give you info on what your up against. If you're down to the last 5 people, you can open up your hand selection, if the table is full you shouldn't be playing anything other than AA, KK, AK and limping in with other pairs hoping for no over cards on the flop, or flopping your 3rd one for a set if you're playing mid-low pairs. Whereas is your last to act, you know what most people are doing. QJ is a nice looking hand, but someone has raised, and someone else re-raised, it's not looking so good anymore. But if the whole table has folded around to you, you're looking great for having the best hand out there, raising it is almost a must, just be careful how you play from there if you get the Small Blind or the Big Blind calling you, and be prepared to back away altogether if the re-raise.

Many many things to think about...one of my fav plays from early position with a monster like AA or KK is to just flat call it, the re-raise huge amounts when someone else raises. Means that people between yourself and the raiser might limp in where they would have folded if you raised it. It's a dangerous play though as maybe no one will raise, then you've just let people limp in and the Big Blind see the flop for free...which can hurt, A LOT! The basic idea of pre flop raising is to reduce the number of players in the hand, and get the Small and Big blinds out of the hand unless they too have something good enough to call a raise. Raise to 3 or 4 times whatever the big blind is.

Oh, never ever raise with small pairs, unless you're one of the last few to act and your raise is just a motion to steal the pot right then and there. I see people do it all the time, espcially at Pub Poker. It's one of the dumbest moves every imo unless to take the pot down pre flop, or if you're small stacked, move all in and hope your 44 holds up.

Say your playing 77, close to 50% of the cards in the deck are higher than yours, what the hell do you do when the flop comes down K84? Could easily be that your opponent is playing a lower pair than you, could be he has an 8 or a K...you put yourself in ugly tough positions whether to call their bets. By increasing then size of the pot, it increases your want to win the pot. They could be on a draw, but you're not going to know until you bet and see if they call...if you do raise and are first to act, make a small continuation bet regardless of what's down, to see if they've hit or not, might be enough to take the pot down...if they call, you're in trouble. Mid and low pocket pairs are for limping, or calling someone else raise, and hoping like hell you hit a set (three of a kind) then you go to fucking town!
[quote]
Oh, and when you get to the later stages of a tournament, or the last few people in a Sit N Go, ALWAYS raise...if your hand is good enough to play, it's good enough to raise. You pretty much never ever want to let the big blind see the flop for free as they could flop two pair, or a straight, or anything enough to smash your AA...but yeah, depending on postion and how people have been playing, the top pairs aren't the only hands to raise one...heck, from the dealer button or close to it, you can raise with 72 off suit and get the pot handed to you.
[quote]
Insanity said:
pstu said:
fuck its hard to understand what you're saying trixty Sad

Oh well will just have to learn


Oh, never ever raise with small pairs, unless you're one of the last few to act and your raise is just a motion to steal the pot right then and there. I see people do it all the time, especially at Pub Poker. It's one of the dumbest moves every imo unless to take the pot down pre flop, or if you're small stacked, move all in and hope your 44 holds up.

Say your playing 77, close to 50% of the cards in the deck are higher than yours, what the hell do you do when the flop comes down K84?.. Mid and low pocket pairs are for limping, or calling someone else raise, and hoping like hell you hit a set (three of a kind) then you go to fucking town!


what?! never ever raise with small pairs? i always raise with any pocket pair in middleish to late position (stricly for tournies so to speak) The most value from small pocket pairs is preflop or unless you do flop a set, sure you can get raised off your hand but remember your opponent doesn't know you have a small pocket pair.. your preflop aggression signals strength which does not neccessarily equate to a small PP so even if the flop comes k84 unless he has KQ+, 88, 44 or some weird two pair he's not going to be THAT happy as you could well hold AK, KK etc. And you shouldn't be ultra scared when you hold 77,88ish type hands and overcards come Razz i do however like to limp/call with small PP in CASH GAMES where its about winning big pots not small ones but in tourny structure raising any PP preflop is def +EV imo i dunno what others think and i dunno if that makes any sense im bad at writing out whats in my head lol
[quote]
and it becomes pretty obvious when people limp call sometimes that they have small PP.. need to vary up your game so your range cant be defined as much..and if you limp and the a few others limp you'll have no idea where you're at when you have 77 and the flop comes 6 high and the BB bets out strongly
[quote]
I said "unless you're late pos"

Late position, table image and how others at table are playing dependent...as a rule though, mid and lo pockets, imo, aren't raising hands unless the table has shown weakness prior to you acting. If you do raise, you've almost guaranteed any callers are doing so with other pairs or monster over cards (bar the idiots calling when they shouldn't). And I'd nearly always throw out a contiunation bet just to see where you stand post-flop. But it's so easy for you to be dominated by are one single card.

And I'm with you on varying your play, hence why I'll somethings limp in with power awaiting to re-raise, or raise in with average etc. And vary the post flop play too.

No set rules on how to play your hands in this game, some like gambling more than others...I think raising with a low pair just isn't all that advisable, unless late pos, and even then, doing so hoping to just close it all out pre-flop. Often you're better off all in with mid/low pockets as the Q on the flop might not be being played, but you just don't know...we've all seen AK get cracked by mid/low pairs, usually it's from an All In though, not a raise then betting out with over pairs on the board...unless they A) a total donk or B) got an amazing fucking read on you
[quote]
Yeah, I routinely raise with any pocket pair, regardless of position. The only thing that would stop me is if I'm playing a tourney and I'm low to medium stack. Then I stop playing low PP, and even then not always. If I'm playing a real passive table I still might play.

At Pub Poker I can certainly see your point though Insanity. I don't know what your pub poker is like but here it's a joke, so if you raise with your 77 and the flop comes K-8-4, you're probably up against K8os and 84os already Wink

But small pairs are where your reading skills will really show a profit. I'd raise preflop with 77. On a K84 flop I'm betting again. If I get called, I'll decide whether I think he has a king, or an underpair, or some sort of draw, and probably bet again Razz
[quote]
if i have 77 and raise PF and its HU and the flop comes K84 im generally pretty happy with it.. you def need good reading skills to play smallish PP's. If all you're doing is praying to hit your set then... i dunno!
[quote]
Yes the above all makes sense. You're right from what I've played Insanity, its about position on the table and I guess how many chips you have in relation to the other players. I guess though in the A-K situation there's not a hell of a lot of difference between being chip leader and fighting for your life on the table. Laughing

Just finished 3rd in another 50-man practice tourney. Starting to hit my straps in this game Cool
[quote]
nothing beats a good 3bet Pink Winky
[quote]
trixytrixer said:
nothing beats a good 3bet Pink Winky


What's a 3bet?
[quote]
The limit-holdem equivalent of a re-raise.

Bet (1 bet)
Raise (2 bet)
Re-raise (3 bet)
[quote]
Mike Matusow Eliminated in 30th Place ($193,000)
And this one is gonna hurt for awhile. Paul Snead raised to 200,000 and Mike Matusow raised to 660,000 from the big blind. Snead called, and they saw a flop Ad As 5h. Both players checked, and when the 9h came on the turn Matusow bet 500,000. Snead moved all in, Matusow called, and that's when Mike learned that his AJ had been overtaken by Snead's A9 . The came on the river, and with that Mike Matusow's run in the Main Event came to an end.

NOOO MIKEY IN A SICK COOLER Sad
[quote]
Fucks sake Sad

That is so cruel.
[quote]
Shame about Mike :/


omg @ Tiffany Michele, you gotta love a girl that loves poker





and lol at some of the strategy comments this afternoon. Nice one gprowl! 25,000 starters fuggin ell, dont know the MTT since I dont play on stars.... is it turbo? Would be insanely long if not
[quote]
Poor dude Crying or Very sad

How that guy is still sane is beyond me... Neutral
[quote]
lol maestro the pic you posted is of brandi hawbaker, quite well known in the poker world who killed herself a few months ago not tiffany michelle..



tiffany^
[quote]
H.O.R.S.E face :\
[quote]
she plays poker and is 3rd in the ME! what do you want gummi!??!!? a euro victorias secret model?!?!?! Froggy
[quote]
errrm wut. pwned by google image search Sad She killed herself? I told you cunts this game that drive you crazy!


Oh and agree with gummi. hee-haww. etc

There must be some hawt asian bitches playing!.../goes off to fish around

hmmmm here we go, google search errrrr "hot" ummm + "asian" + "poker" ermmmmm oh dear...
[quote]
gummi_bear said:
H.O.R.S.E face :\


SICK pun! Very Happy
[quote]
The Maestro said:

There must be some hawt asian bitches playing!.../goes off to fish around


Liz Lieu is about the hottest I've seen, and even she's pretty standard. There's a couple up the casino though. Real hard to read :/
[quote]
Evelyn Ng is pretty hot Maestro...


The only other female asian poker player I can think of is Mimi Tran, haha.
[quote]
yeah evelyn, mimi tran, liz lieu, maria ho are the only ones that come to mind.

There was a cute one wearing a kimono at the main event a couple years ago Razz
[quote]
Yaksha said:
maria ho


o lol

Found a website thats perfect for sickos like me!


www.pokerbeauties.com


8.30 $10 KO! Cmon you lot!
[quote]
With all this discussion of AK, I thought I'd get your opinion regarding the hand during early stages of a tourney.

Obviously AK plays differently in a cash game to a tourney, but does it also play differently depending on the stage of a tournament?

Example: Late pos during 2nd stage of blinds in a SnG and are dealt AKs, facing a raise and re-raise, who would fold this?

Obviously later on in the game or short stacked this hand is more often than not an instant call...
[quote]
Depends on the 2 villians, if they are super tight I *might* find a fold...but would probably still look to take a flop in position as cheap as possible

As for AK short stacked late..... Instant push 99% of the time rather than a call, regardless of previous action/opponents
[quote]
Personally, it'll take a hell of a lot to get me off AKs at any point Razz But that's just me, most people think I overplay it heh.

But in general I don't see anything wrong with calling a re-raise with it at any level, you might well be ahead anyway. But don't call off like 30% of your stack or anything. 10-15% is fine.. or 20% if you know the person is tight as and will fold their 99 to any overcards..
[quote]
Had a specific hand like that recently, although it was raise, re-raise all in, then me to act - which is what i was thinking of when I wrote the above post. It can just be such a fickle hand to play multiway pots with IMO, but then I play a hellova lot more cash than tourney.
[quote]
rust_ said:
does it also play differently depending on the stage of a tournament?

...



btw many many hands must be played differently in relation to the esculating blind structures. this is probably the most important thing to grasp in becoming a succesfull MTT player


siiiiigh Im out again, JJ sux so much


Full Tilt Poker Game #7215966414: $10 + $1 Knockout (54750143), Table 7 - 30/60 - No Limit Hold'em - 5:01:37 ET - 2008/07/14

Seat 1: IRON_FIST_NZ (3,265)
Seat 2: mariusgus (9,120)
Seat 3: rusty_knifenz (2,815)
Seat 4: mdailam (2,995)
Seat 5: MyKeyLor (4,365)
Seat 6: mellman SWGA (5,947)
Seat 7: KKbluntKK (2,975)
Seat 8: murp1956 (3,402)
Seat 9: nokose83 (5,595)

IRON_FIST_NZ posts the small blind of 30
mariusgus posts the big blind of 60
The button is in seat #9

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to IRON_FIST_NZ [Js Jh]

rusty_knifenz folds
mdailam folds
MyKeyLor folds
mellman SWGA folds
KKbluntKK folds
murp1956 raises to 210
nokose83 folds
IRON_FIST_NZ raises to 690
mariusgus folds
murp1956 raises to 2,130
IRON_FIST_NZ has 15 seconds left to act
IRON_FIST_NZ raises to 3,265, and is all in
murp1956 calls 1,135
IRON_FIST_NZ shows [Js Jh]
murp1956 shows [9d 9h]

*** FLOP *** [2c Kc 2h]

*** TURN *** [2c Kc 2h] [9c]

*** RIVER *** [2c Kc 2h 9c] [9s]

IRON_FIST_NZ shows two pair, Jacks and Nines
murp1956 shows four of a kind, Nines
murp1956 wins the pot (6,590) with four of a kind, Nines

IRON_FIST_NZ stands up
[quote]
in any SNG for me that's always an instant push barring some psychic crazy super read.. it just is im happy to get it in vs QQ or JJ. if he has AA its a cooler.. but thats just me, im a degen? Very Happy
[quote]
Folding AK suited in smaller ($1-30) buy ins is often a mistake, donks are getgting it in with A-X a lot
[quote]
pretty standard there maesty, did you ever think your jacks were good when you saw he had 99?
[quote]
The Maestro said:
Folding AK suited in smaller ($1-30) buy ins is often a mistake, donks are getgting it in with A-X a lot


absolutely, at those level its always an instant push people think AQ is the nuts here
[quote]
I did after the flop!

ok actually i'll stop cluttering up this thread with my bad beat whines now. Mad

Somehow else post some interesting hand histories for us to dissect
[quote]
Yea what I wrote and what I was thinking were slightly different. I was talking about calling an all-in bet in that situation. I absolutely agree that it's a call most of the time is it's not a large portion of your stack, and an instant shove when short stacked. Maestro I think you're right about the buy-in level affecting the decision also. Case and point: the original raiser had TT and the player that shoved had AQos.

Iron_fist gets busted by runner runner quad 9's... that was a very sick hand indeed.
[quote]
ermmmm. Your not rustyknifenz are you? :O
[quote]
hmmm havent been playing much online lately ill post some ones ive got stored in pokertracker that are fun

first

Full Tilt Poker Game #6168199810: Table Fernando - $1/$2 - No Limit Holdem - 2:55:56 ET - 2008/04/25
Seat 1: RageTiltSnap ($152.30)
Seat 2: endre21 ($186.10)
Seat 3: Standover73 ($99.55)
Seat 4: 0wins ($316)
Seat 5: Bluffsalot83 ($202)
Seat 6: smitty83 ($103.90)
Seat 7: uagrad ($200)
Seat 8: meate8or ($100)
Seat 9: CLOUDHAND ($177.65)
CLOUDHAND posts the small blind of $1
RageTiltSnap posts the big blind of $2
smitty83 posts $2
The button is in seat #8
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to RageTiltSnap [Ah As]
endre21 folds
Standover73 raises to $7
0wins folds
Bluffsalot83 folds
smitty83 folds
uagrad folds
meate8or folds
CLOUDHAND folds
RageTiltSnap raises to $19
Standover73 calls $12
*** FLOP *** [8s 6s 3c]
RageTiltSnap checks
RageTiltSnap has been disconnected
Standover73 has 15 seconds left to act
Standover73 bets $25
RageTiltSnap has reconnected
RageTiltSnap has 15 seconds left to act
RageTiltSnap raises to $133.30, and is all in
Standover73 calls $55.55, and is all in
RageTiltSnap shows [Ah As]
Standover73 shows [Qc Qh]
Uncalled bet of $52.75 returned to RageTiltSnap
*** TURN *** [8s 6s 3c] [Js]
*** RIVER *** [8s 6s 3c Js] [Qd]
RageTiltSnap shows a pair of Aces
Standover73 shows three of a kind, Queens
Standover73 wins the pot ($199.10) with three of a kind, Queens
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $202.10 | Rake $3
Board: [8s 6s 3c Js Qd]
Seat 1: RageTiltSnap (big blind) showed [Ah As] and lost with a pair of Aces
Seat 2: endre21 didnt bet (folded)
Seat 3: Standover73 showed [Qc Qh] and won ($199.10) with three of a kind, Queens
Seat 4: 0wins didnt bet (folded)
Seat 5: Bluffsalot83 didnt bet (folded)
Seat 6: smitty83 folded before the Flop
Seat 7: uagrad didnt bet (folded)
Seat 8: meate8or (button) didnt bet (folded)
Seat 9: CLOUDHAND (small blind) folded before the Flop

everybody loves a one outer right??? right???
[quote]
The Maestro said:
ermmmm. Your not rustyknifenz are you? :O


:O Indeed. That's me. Currently struggling to pick up a playable hand in the tourney.
[quote]
Oh ok well in that case...ie calling a big all in when you have a large stack in relation to blinds.

Thats a tougher one. Heres a couple of factors that not many think of

# Who are the players? And not just the raisers I mean the whole table. If youre a casual inexperinced player at table of good players and a few pros its probably a god idea to take the odds of doubling up.

However If the table is full of donks and you feel comfortable in your ability to outplay them, then I might be more inclined to pass up the small edge in return for keeping the ability/stack to small ball their asses to death

# How did the all in happen? If it folded round till the cut off who raised and got pushed by the button. Id be more inclined to play my AK than if the raise came from EP and the push from MP

Not only cos people play cards differently from position. But if the table goes fold-fold-fold-fold-fold-*play* theres a slightly better chance none of those folding hands had aces, since many players play any A-X hand

^^ a slightly wacky theory but one I like a bit Cool
[quote]
the shove is hardly ever aces or kings tho is it? people love to 3 bet that cause they want action it tends to be AQ AKss maybe AJ and JJ,QQ depending on how bad they are.. i find it rare people will shove aces or kings to one persons raise? if they are a good player your shove signals massive strength of KK, AA, AK being the majority % of your range so IF they are a good player the initial raiser could easily fold 1010, JJ, QQ maybe.. but yeah at low level sit and go's people are usually pretty donkish Neutral i like your theory about playing like that when people are donks at the table maesty but the structure of online sit and go's are terrible that to me its an all in or fold? (AI 95%-99% Very Happy)
[quote]
I been thinking a bit Maestro. You have been running *terrible* last little while obviously, but I'm wondering (with all due respect Wink) if you don't bring it on yourself a little bit?

I don't know how your online MTT game has progressed since we last started doing poker-school, but I remember your style generally meant that you were hanging around the outskirts of average-stack and trying hard to make the money, then make near the FT before you'd really take a risk. A classic Hellmuth kind of approach. But he bitches an awful lot about beats too right? :>

I'm wondering if you're exacerbating the problem by the sheer fact that when you do go all in, you're likely to be covered. Whereas if you had a monster stack going deep, the beats from short stacks wouldn't hit you as bad?

The more I read from the pros, every single one of them (except Hellmuth and Negreanu) recommend acquiring chips like a madman in big-field tournaments so that you can have room to manuevre later on. I think your style means you REALLY need those AK vs AJ type hands to go your way. People that are playing to make the top 3 (instead of make the money) basically all advocate hyper-aggression..
[quote]
agreed yak you need to get chips early in those tournaments if you really want to go to deep and you need to have a bit of gamble in you at the start, if you fold and dont take risks you're hoping for the deck to hit you in the face or get really lucky
[quote]
Oh also Maesty... let's start up the biggie online game again? Smile We must have enough people to play now...
[quote]
maesty please tell you've heard of rakeback and have a rakeback deal??? i just told yak about it, getting 27% back on all rake you pay

http://www.rakereduction.com/ go here if you haven't
[quote]
Yaksha said:
Oh also Maesty... let's start up the biggie online game again? Smile We must have enough people to play now...


I'd be keen Cool
[quote]
Thanks guys Very Happy

It's not a turbo tournament, was about 5 and a half hours play. The differences between it and say $1 tourneys was insane, about 10% of hands make it to showdown, as opposed to 90% of said $1 tournaments.

It's only an $11 tourney (Annette Oberstrad or w/e has won it before lol) and I think there's a lot of dead money in there (bad players) but the late field was very talented. I could have folded my way to another $50 but I didn't want to play negative poker, if I had started like that I'd only have made $25.

Does FT have an equivilent $11 tourney? I'm sure a lot of bad players enter it making for some (eventual) profit. I noticed some players making very iffy calls
(calling with A2o to a preflop all-in with very bad odds)... now i'm looking for a job that goes Tue-Fri as I want my Monday off to play poker!

So where do you guys learn poker? I'm reading Kill Everyone, the rest I've been mostly learning myself (and NPPL... urgh!).
[quote]
Hmmmm. My last hand of the tourney:

Short stacked, get dealt 1010 and shove in mid-late pos for about 6bb. Called by 1 big stack with 67os. 3 5 on the flop, 4 on the river Neutral

It's times like these that I curse and convince myself that fulltilt favours big stacks in order to get tournaments over with faster. Rolling Eyes


But in other news, bring on the biggie online game! Music
[quote]
Yep Im pretty nitty/small ball, you'll see in my OPR that I finish early only 3% of the time to 10% average. I have changed a bit since the poker school days in terms of opening up a little early...but not significantly.

Im not sure that taking more risks is the way to end my bad streak. Check out Annettes last 120 days, shes getting creamed

http://www.officialpokerrankings.com/pokerstars/Annette_15/poker/results/6D5BD1ADE6434909BEB751074A18CFF2.html?t=2

ie = its just the way the cookie crumbles for MTT'ers. I'll come right. It only takes one tourney. In the meantime I'll keep going crazy and moaning over here Cool Im not actually losing money playing poker, Im just not winning significant amounts

You are right with your points about my style making me unable to withstand bad beats though. I dont beleive in getting all my chips in on coin flips against opponents I can outplay small ball.

Yep trixy...Im actually a member of raketherake, unfortunately tho I dont get any as I found out about it after I signed for my main rooms :/


Question for nacoa. How the fark do you keep getting given money by party poker? Confused C*nts have never given me anything Mad
[quote]
lol you only have 6bb tho... i've learnt pretty much from playing exclusively and reading online poker forums and stuff, havent read any poker books ive skimmed over a few but they seemed so boring.. like they say practice makes perfect! and nah FT doesnt have an equivalent to the sunday 11$ 100k on stars.. stars prides itself on being a tournament specialist site whereas full tilt is mainly cash
[quote]
25,000 players....5 1/2 hours play... non turbo? Confused

Blind s up ever 10 minutes? I know you didnt final table but thats still a hell of a lot of players knocked out over that period of time. I won the midnight madness on FT which I think was about 1200 field and that took 5/6 hours
[quote]
annette just shipped the sunday brawl earlier for 50k tho! why dont you start a new account for the RB? you're missing out on a ton of free money...
[quote]
Regarding rakeback - try emailing Fulltilt support about it. They signed me up to rakebackpros.com

The email I sent them was literally "Is it possible for me to use my existing fulltilt account to sign up for a rake back deal?".
[quote]
id be keen for a biggie game.

as long as it's not on full tilt Froggy
[quote]
Just came 3rd in one of those 90 player $3 turbo SNGs on full tilt -- best cash yet, lol :>

Funny thing was I was chip leader with about 15 players left and this horribly short-stacked dude goes all in. I call from the big blind with A-7 suited, he shows A-7 off suit. And the cunt makes a flush on the river Neutral

And from then he just started getting some primo hands and was chip leader going into heads up Laughing
[quote]
Playing cash tables last night, just 25/50c.

Built my stack upto $43 from $10, playing some nice hands and bl;uffing when in position.

Got a bit cocky though, raised my A,K suited, the big blind re-raises me, he has bluffed most of night so I re-raise again to test him, he goes all-in... still have a inkling he is bluffing still, and I have a strong hand, so call.

He has QQ and I don't hit... should of folded!!!

BOOO
[quote]
You did the right thing nacoa, dumping QQ preflop to a known maniac is a mistake fo sure. His range includes many (10-15?) hands and you are only dominated by two of them. Try not to be results orientated Smile (disclaimer, I know sweet fuck all about cash games. I dislike them)

I like those KO's on TILT, they only last 1 3/4 hours max and plenty of people put waaaay too big an importance on the KO money. I wish Tilt would sort it so KO's that a player has made are displayed on their seat like badges of honour. Would encourage the maniacs even more to get their chips in bad

Althought I must confess it is fun keeping track of how many you have Very Happy
[quote]
Yaksha said:
Yeah, I routinely raise with any pocket pair, regardless of position. The only thing that would stop me is if I'm playing a tourney and I'm low to medium stack. Then I stop playing low PP, and even then not always. If I'm playing a real passive table I still might play.


That's really funny, as I distinctly remember you telling me off a while ago for a pre flop raise ith TT as it's "not a raising hand". May have even been in this very thread! Razz
[quote]
nacoa said:
Playing cash tables last night, just 25/50c.

Built my stack upto $43 from $10, playing some nice hands and bl;uffing when in position.

Got a bit cocky though, raised my A,K suited, the big blind re-raises me, he has bluffed most of night so I re-raise again to test him, he goes all-in... still have a inkling he is bluffing still, and I have a strong hand, so call.

He has QQ and I don't hit... should of folded!!!

BOOO


SEE, SOMETIMES AK GETS YOU NOWHERE!!!

Razz
[quote]
ill take AKss vs QQ anyday of the week, flips are sexy Pink Winky
[quote]
Insanity said:
Yaksha said:
Yeah, I routinely raise with any pocket pair, regardless of position. The only thing that would stop me is if I'm playing a tourney and I'm low to medium stack. Then I stop playing low PP, and even then not always. If I'm playing a real passive table I still might play.


That's really funny, as I distinctly remember you telling me off a while ago for a pre flop raise ith TT as it's "not a raising hand". May have even been in this very thread! Razz


hahaha there is no way I said that. I vaguely remember what you're talking about, but it wasn't in this thread, and can't find the exact quote. If memory serves me, I think you raised to 3 x bb or something and got called by a ridiculous hand which hit on the flop. I might've said you shouldn't raise so small with it because it's vulnerable, and just push instead, or something Razz
[quote]
trixytrixer said:
ill take AKss vs QQ anyday of the week, flips are sexy Pink Winky


Flips? You mean flop, turn, river or something else?
[quote]
heh flip = coinflip pstu.

A 50/50 shot.
[quote]
Here it is Insanity:

http://www.biggie.co.nz/interaction/forum/viewtopic.php?t=164946

You were facing 7-8 callers ahead of you in pub poker, and min-raised from the big blind with 10-10. And then you were upset that 7-7 had called you Wink All I'd said was that calling with 77 was a great call (with 8 people in the pot, if he hits a set it's jackpot), and that the min-raise with 10-10 was way worse because all you're doing is building up a pot which you're so unlikely to win unless you hit a set.

Smile
[quote]
Ahh I C. Smile

How is AK vs QQ 50/50, doesn't the QQ have a much higher chance of winning the hand?


And Yakky, are you the man sorting the biggie game... If so on which site?

Mr. Green
[quote]
(It's down the bottom of that page btw)
[quote]
soo um that brandon cantu guy eh... IS HE A COMPLETE FUCKING MUPPET OR WHAT? he's out now tho but check this out Neutral

Kelly Kim opened for 275,000, Brandon Cantu reraised to 950,000, and Dean Hamrick moved all in. The crowd let out an "Ooooooooooh!" and got on their feet as the action came back to Kim. Kim let his hand go and it was Cantu's turn to tank. Cantu thought for well over five minutes (Tim Loecke getting knocked out in the meantime) before saying "I call."

Cantu {10-Spades} {5-Clubs}

Hamrick {A-Hearts} {A-Clubs}

There was mass disbelief and gasps from the crowd as Cantu rolled over his hand.

The flop was {8-Spades} {7-Clubs} {5-Hearts} and Cantu flopped a pair of fives. The turn was the {8-Diamonds}, a bad card for Cantu as Hamrick made aces up. Cantu paced in back of the table looking resigned to his fate as his entourage called for a five. The river, though was the {10-Diamonds} and Cantu made two pair, but it was no matter-- Hamrick's aces and eights were best and he raked in the massive pot.

Cantu was down to 2.4 million after the hand while Hamrick was up to 5.5 million. Cantu is now the tournament's shortest stack.

the call all in was around 1.8 million chips... so sick if that 8 didnt peel off and he took it with two pair Neutral

weird thing is he's not an amateur he won a WPT and plays cash regularly and shit... maybe he's just gone insane?
[quote]
pstu said:
How is AK vs QQ 50/50, doesn't the QQ have a much higher chance of winning the hand?


AKs v QQ is 50/50.. Smile

Think of it this way. Each card has about a 2% chance of coming up. (52 cards, minus the two you've already seen, your cards). So if you've got AK, there are three Aces and three Kings left. That's six outs, 12%. Then times that by five, cause there's five community cards, so that's 60%. So you've got a 60% chance of hitting an Ace or a King. Equally, the pocket queens have two more queens to hit, (4%) x 4 (4 community cards, + your ace or your king that you hit) - so 16%.. so take that off your 60% because if both happen, you will lose. So that's 46%... and then add a little bit more because of your straight and flush opportunities. Works out about 52/48 Smile

Maestro set it up the last time... but he's crap at organising Wink So might give Full Tilt a buzz.



And Yakky, are you the man sorting the biggie game... If so on which site?

Mr. Green[/quote]
[quote]
I was far from upset about it, bro...I'd be calling with any pocket pair in that situ anytime, anyday also. My only point here was that you explicetly stated about how you'd "routinely raise with any pocket pair, regardless of position" yet had previously given me shit for it. Make sense? Razz

Also links to my point prior (which you also gave me crap for) about NOT raising with mid/low pockets, they're hands for creaming massive pots when you hit sets or snaffling small pots as no one else has hit. Otherwise guy with his 77, who was first or second to act, would have raised pushing half the runners out of the pot. And post-flop would have collected less as the person he cleaned out (playing 75 to a 557 flop) would most likely have not been in the hand.

My point was that you're fairly well contradicting yourself! Froggy
[quote]
Insanity said:
I was far from upset about it, bro...I'd be calling with any pocket pair in that situ anytime, anyday also. My only point here was that you explicetly stated about how you'd "routinely raise with any pocket pair, regardless of position" yet had previously given me shit for it. Make sense? Razz


Of course it makes sense Razz But you've misunderstood. I wasn't giving you shit about raising with it, I was giving you shit for the amount of your raise. With 7-8 callers ahead of you, you either want to just check and pray for a miracle flop, or raise a LOT so that you can get down to maybe 2 callers, and then guage where you are from there. I was giving you shit for min-raising, which builds the pot, and will knock no one out heh.

Insanity said:
Also links to my point prior (which you also gave me crap for) about NOT raising with mid/low pockets, they're hands for creaming massive pots when you hit sets or snaffling small pots as no one else has hit.


Well it depends. In a pub poker environment I wouldn't recommend raising, because there's no point, people will call anyway. But if you're in a decent online tourney and amongst the chip-leaders with 30 people left (out of 600 starting) and the antes/blinds are quite high and the table is quite passive?... Raising with a small pair is easily the correct play, because the benefit from simply stealing the blinds is huge.

Even earlier on in a tournament, if you've got some chips to play with, you can raise with small pairs because people won't put you on it. Then either you hit your set, or just continuation bet anyway and people might put you on a big pair etc..

There's no contradiction in what I said whatsoever. Wink
[quote]
Id just like to add for the newbs looking to improve their game, "routinely raising with any pair" is FUBAR/only for maniacs/very good players

Best you organise it with TILT as I did last time and the game expired after only a few weeks Very Happy Usual 8pm Monday slot is it? $3/$5 rebuy?

Interbreed sorry it pretty much has to be Tilt, Party Poker doesnt do private sitngoes


psssssstu you have a Full Tilt account? PM me if not and I'll set you up with a deal Wink
[quote]
The Maestro said:
Id just like to add for the newbs looking to improve their game, "routinely raising with any pair" is FUBAR/only for maniacs/very good players


Nothing wrong with being a maniac you nit Wink But yes you need good reading/analysis skills to back it up.


Re: Biggie Online game.

I'll try to set it up with Tilt.

What do you guys reckon? $5 rebuy? $10 rebuy?
Who's in?

And does Monday night suit all? We need to make sure we'll get a regular following to keep it running etc Smile
[quote]
FT. Check.

$5. Check. (Start small yakky, we're not all pros) Razz

Monday night. Check.

Masty you have pm

Cool
[quote]
Tick here for $5 too, keep it affordable for all = longevity sp

No add on I reckon too Yak
[quote]
lol, i pretty much always raise pre-flop with a small-mid pocket pair (except in the early stages of a tourney) and, depending on my position, the number of players in the pot, my chip stack etc. will pretty much always make a continuation bet after the flop as well Razz

ME == NOOB MANIAC!! Very Happy
[quote]
Sunday Hundred Grand does have a lot of Muppets I bet, even though you start with 3,000 (standard tourneys in PS are 1,500) there are still fast elimination.

I think the main reason is the payout structure; Top 3851 get $25, but then it's so flat that you have to make top 360 to get $50, then it sharply goes upward. 3851-2000 went by just as fast as 3951-3852. So many people were like "sweet, made the money, I'm doubling up or busting!".
[quote]
Fuck Sad

Tiffany Michelle knocked out in 17th. Now there is noone to root for on the final table... *sigh*... Why did Mikey have to get coolered Sad
[quote]
What's a good 'first time code' for FT?

I get the feeling FT is better for ring games and PS for tourneys, so I might take some out of my PS account and make a deposit into FT...
[quote]
Yaksha/trixy hook the man up...I got pssssst Very Happy


wait for someone to refer you gprowl, you get a better deal on your 1st deposite bonus etc that way

I'll give them 15 minutes to pounce or Im in there, you are actually far better off with me anyway because I play critical mass = get your bonus faster
[quote]
I'm glad you guys said I did the right thing... sucks when you work 3-4 hours gaining 400% of ya buy in then losing it all in one hand Sad

Oh well... still have $10 on, will build it up with $1 and $3 sit n gos until its healthy to play again.
[quote]
You can have it Maesty Razz I'm at work, can't do anything from here.
[quote]
gprowl....PM sent
[quote]
nacoa said:
I'm glad you guys said I did the right thing...


I think the only thing I think you were doing wrong was playing too higher stakes with too low buy in.
25c/50c blinds with only $10 at the table doesn't leave many, if any, room for error.
You want to play the full buy in at tables so that when you have "that hand" you capitalise on it to the maximum that you can.
$25 at the table on the 10c/25c.
[quote]
Insanity said:
nacoa said:
I'm glad you guys said I did the right thing...


I think the only thing I think you were doing wrong was playing too higher stakes with too low buy in.
25c/50c blinds with only $10 at the table doesn't leave many, if any, room for error.
You want to play the full buy in at tables so that when you have "that hand" you capitalise on it to the maximum that you can.
$25 at the table on the 10c/25c.


I had built it up to $43 at the time I lost the hand.
[quote]
Yaksha said:
Of course it makes sense Razz But you've misunderstood. I wasn't giving you shit about raising with it, I was giving you shit for the amount of your raise. With 7-8 callers ahead of you, you either want to just check and pray for a miracle flop, or raise a LOT so that you can get down to maybe 2 callers, and then guage where you are from there. I was giving you shit for min-raising, which builds the pot, and will knock no one out heh.


I freely admitted at the time it was a min raise specifically to build the pot, not an attemped to push anyone out! I was just staring down at TT and was feeling lucky so I thought I'd squeeze an extra few bucks out of people, not push them out. Confused

It was play money, I was playing around...if I hit my set, most people will fold to any bet unless they've hit, so the min raise would have put an extra 400-600 in the pot which otherwise wouldn't have been there.
[quote]
i dont understand the min raise at all but on play money tables its a different thing ..

DAMN TIFFANY OUT NOOOO!!! bunch of randoms now Sad dont really care Neutral

5$ rebuy would be good for FT