NZ Cricket - Where To From Here?

It's time to drop Cairns, McMillan, Vincent and Vettori, Adams as well. Styris down the order. And time to think about replacements (maybe for Astle as well)

Here are the top scorers from the State Championship:

RA Jones9 18 4 667 128 47.64 2 3 8 - WELL

MJ Horne8 12 0 649 187 54.08 2 3 2 - AUCK

TG McIntosh 9 15 2 610 157 46.92 1 4 7 - AUCK
RJ Nicol 9 14 2 603 147* 50.25 1 5 5 - AUCK

So for Sri Lanka I'd like to see McIntosh and Richardson opening the innings (or Horne and Richardson), with Nicol in the team at #4 or #5, dependent on Fleming's position. Jones might be an outside choice as well but he's not young anymore.

Now, what about allrounders. Check out
TK Canning 8 12 2 405 113 40.50 1 - 6 - AUCK
TK Canning 8 353 116 859 40 21.47 5-62 1 - 52.9 2.43 AUCK

He's top wicket taker and averages 40 with the bat. Ferocious performances by a potential Cairns-replacement.

Bowling?
IE O'Brien 7 221 74 536 32 16.75 6-103 2 - 41.4 2.42 WELL
MJ Mason 8 275.4 95 623 31 20.09 6-56 2 1 53.3 2.25 CD
IG Butler 6 146.2 37 444 19 23.36 5-44 1 - 46.2 3.03 ND


There's your next generation of strike bowlers... my dream NZ test team for SL

RICHARDSON
MCINTOSH
HORNE
FLEMING
NICOL
STYRIS
MILLS
CANNING
HART R
BOND
BUTLER

That's 1 150k bowler, 1 140k, 1 130+ seamer in Mills, one into the wind merchant in Canning, offspin from Nicol, and Styris as well... a well balanced team.

They need to focas on specialised positions.
Has been to much attention to allrounders

They definately need to get some of the dead weight in the team that has been clinging on for too long. Whats the point in continually picking players the are consistently inconsistent and that are injured half the time?

Nice points there Crome, but you wanna break down the stats for me??

TK Canning 8 12 2 405 113 40.50 1 - 6 - AUCK

I assume the order is Innings, Matchs, NO, Runs, Top Score, Average and dunno bout the rest.

TK Canning 8 353 116 859 40 21.47 5-62 1 - 52.9 2.43 AUCK

Matches, balls bowled, runs scored from, ???, Wickets, Average, Best Bowling, dunno the rest

Batting:
Matches-Innings-NO-Runs-Top Score-Average-100s-50s-Catches

Bowling
Matches-Overs-Maidens-Runs Condeded-Wickets-Average-Best Bowling-5wicket innings-strike rate-econ rate

Where to from here? WHO CARES??? Lets face it, we just ain't got the talent.

Plenty of talent at the domestic level that isn't getting a chance

calls to drop cairns and astle are a bit rough, other than that some good points...

if kyle mills learns how to play within the laws of the game i think he may add something... butler is still very green but i would like to see nicol and horne in the longer form of the game... hopefully tim macintosh has sorted his head out from school days, admittedly it was a while ago, but he was a total pothead at school and started to throw his life down the toilet...

and there is no point picking robbie hart, not only has he never been any good, he is also past his prime, i think we'd be much better grooming a young keeper, and mccullum is unfortunately looking like our best option...

and fish boy you're dead wrong about the talent call mate, in fact thats about all we do have... talent and promise, its consistency and mental fortitude that we lack, much like every other sport

Mills is a 'solid' player, something we lack

As for McIntosh... the only drug he seems to be on now is valium as he delights in boring opposition attacks to death with his 'run an over' assault!

Cheers Crome

yeap i think the main thing we lack is consistency, as for dropping some players, def macmillian and vincent need to go

Im definetly keen on Nicol but Matt Horne? You guys have got a short memory, hes one of the most gutless international cricketers we’ve produced

He got all the talent but a woeful inferiority complex imo

NZ first class cricket is no test of a player. First class stats mean nothing. NZ players are picked on their mental attitude, and their technique.

NZC has finally realised that we're never really going to be able to strengthen our domestic cricet to a reasonable standard, which is why we're sending more players to aus, and placing more emphasis on the 'A' side.

There are some players in the side that have been there too long, but some of the ones you've mentioned (Adams and Vincent in particular) are just developing. There's no doubt (in my mind) they have the talent. They just haven't produced it on the field.

maybe astle? Dude, that guy should have been dropped down the order along time ago. When hes on fire hes hot, but its becoming a rare occasion.

I think Vettori is doing alright

you can't say that about astle, he still has the highest average in the team and has scored 9 more centuries than his next closest competitors...

the thing about mr astle is his away from home record, he has far less success away from home, and thats where he becomes hot and cold...

and as you say it is becoming a rare occasion, but is it any less rare than anyone else? i think not... in fact its at least 3 times more likely to happen than to any other batsman...

Astle is a class batsman and has a record that ensures he should remain in the team. Cairns should be there as a batsman as well. McMillan needs to be taken to SL but should be dropped if he doesn't perform, he has so much ability and is in a slump at the moment he will come out of. Vettori needs to be there, he is clearly our best spinner and has a record the equal or better of any spinner we've had. Adams need to earn his place. Agree with vincent being dropped, but not too sure of replacement, jones would be my number 1 pick with horne and mcintosh not too far behind. I would definitely like to see O'brien chosen. He seems to have the goods, but not too sure about test level. Tuffey and Oram should be certainties as well.

not much wrong with our players, i think our selection board should go especially richard hadlee, i think they stuff up our cricketers more than anything, the chopping and changing of teams and positions has led to the state we are in. Astle, vittori, fleming, cairns and harry are all brilliant players.

adams needs more coaching, to hot tempered and too irratic, mccallum ok behind the wickets needs more confidence in his batting

should learn to go out there and have fun hit the ball a bit maybe we think too much sometimes.

need another specialst bowler like bond tuffy and oram are good just not upto that level though

Adams is 27. Not a developing player. Old. Mills is 23 - which one would you rather have?
As for first class stats, any batsmen who can average 45+ on NZ wickets is pretty good in my book. Nicol is technically excellent. Horne may have a few flaws, but nothing major, while McIntosh is limited yet effective. As for the bowlers - Canning won't take wickets in tests (unless it's a green top), but he can take pressure off bowlers at the other end through line/length, a sort of Chatfield role

Vettori's record is shit...

Compare it to other spinners NZ has produced, or are you saying we don't need a spinner in Sri Lanka.

Rob Nicol can bowl a few offbreaks... Vettori isn't a spinner, he's a very slow medium pacer

matt horne has never performed for n.z and isn't rob nicol that cunt who caused all the trouble a few months back.
quite frankly good performance at national level usually means fuck all when they get to play for NZ
(they usually start playing crap for a start and then the dope smoking and pub brawls start)

Horne

TESTS
(including 01/05/2002)
M I NO Runs HS Ave SR 100 50 Ct St
Batting & Fielding 33 61 2 1714 157 29.05 41.00 4 5 17 0

you can chuck statistics around all you like, they mean fuck-all to me. Matt Horne has never done the bizzo with the bat in internationals hence why he's not in the team now

That is not rob nicol the cricketer chopper, it was someone else of the same name. As for Horne, his record is average, but compare them to these figures

M I NO Runs HS Ave 100 50 Ct St
Batting & Fielding 39 68 4 1958 161 30.59 3 12 14 0

Average only 1.5 higher, 1 less century. Who is this player - bruce edgar, considered one of our better openers. 4 centuries in 31 tests compares favourably with many of our openers of the past. Outside richardson and wright in the later stages of his career none have done much better. Wright averaged under 30 for the first half of his career at least.

Murray Deaker (who I normally don't have much time for) made some very interesting points the other day. Most people who follow cricket in NZ started in 1982 with the first aussie tri series with the underarm incident etc. At the time the NZ team was better than it had ever been. They compare it to that team and of course it never lives up to it. Before then NZ almost never won tests, first win in 1956, first vs aussie in 1974, england 78. The current team is the second best team we have had. 3rd best test team in the world sums that up. Bond is also our second best bowler ever so expecting another of his ability to appear is unrealistic, we should be just glad we have him.

Maybe we should ask to field a NZ team in the Aussie state championship. Would probably have to make ot the full NZ tea.m though to stand a chance

Another point, apart from aussie and India, who were a better team than us at the world cup?

Thats a good question, prolly have to say no-one but Im a bit biased

What happened to Goldie anyway?

Hes shit....... just got out for one again

goldie didn't get in the team becasue it was picked so early he didn't have a chance to make a decent claim. Oh yeah, and also cause he wasn't anywhere near good enough.

Danny Morrison hit 'Bond' ability right at the end of his career - he turned from a easy-hit into a very, very potent quick and I believe he was probably around the 150 range as well. His 7 wicket haul against Australia, and his hat trick against India, were both amazing... so saying Bond is #2 is a little premature.

Danny was the unluckiest bowler Ive ever seen, not only did his heyday coincide with our worst slip cordon dropsies of all time, he couldnt buy an LBW despite being such a short-ass

danny was unlucky, but the 'experts' are saying that bond is already our second best bowler, and looking at the stats he is really, he just hasn't had a long enough career to dwarf morrison's stats yet...

not to take anything away from big danny though, he was always a trooper and our only hope through some testing years

he'd have been VERY lucky to push 150 though

From what Ive seen Id rate Bond over Danny for sure

I never saw the likes of Cunis, Bartlett etc though so dunno about 2nd best ever

erm....."Bartlett"... I meant Dick Motz

When Danny "bowled" (Steve Waugh constantly accused Danny of throwing it) his shorter one, not his bouncer, he hurried up a lot of bats... 145+ I'd say

Our second best would be Cowie. Nailed the Don for a duck.

donald who?

You know, that Aussie slogger with the backlift towards 3rd man... technique like that he'd never have made any runs, right!

Now some coach would try to make him change his technique.

Agree that Morrison rates right up there, but still rate bond higher. As for the older bowlers, they all averaged around 30 and only about 3 wickets per test.