All Blacks end of the year tour

ALL BLACKS SQUAD

John Afoa - Auckland
Anthony Boric - North Harbour
Daniel Carter - Canterbury
Jimmy Cowan - Southland
Stephen Donald - Waikato
Jason Eaton - Taranaki
Andy Ellis - Canterbury
Ross Filipo - Wellington
Corey Flynn - Canterbury
Ben Franks - * Tasman
Hosea Gear - * Wellington
Andrew Hore - Taranaki
Cory Jane * Wellington
Richard Kahui - Waikato
Jerome Kaino - Auckland
Richie McCaw - Canterbury (captain)
Jamie Mackintosh - * Southland
Keven Mealamu - Auckland
Liam Messam - * Waikato
Malili Muliaina - Waikato
Ma’a Nonu - Wellington
Kieran Read - * Canterbury
Josevata Rokocoko - Auckland
Sitiveni Sivivatu - Waikato
Conrad Smith - Wellington
Rodney So’oialo - Wellington
Adam Thomson - Otago
Brad Thorn - Tasman
Neemia Tialata - Wellington
Isaia Toeava - Auckland
Anthony Tuitavake - North Harbour
Scott Waldrom - * Taranaki
Piri Weepu - Wellington
Ali Williams - Tasman
Tony Woodcock - North Harbour

Solid team imo.

Thoughts?

Fucking mean squad imo, was a bit concerned the selectors weren't going to pick some of the young guys but they've stuck to the form choices which is great to see.

Stoked they've finally selected Messam, well deserved

We are going to CRUSH those NH chumps.....

Cant stand Ma’a Nonu, I personally dont like him.

Other than that, im happy

Looks great to me.
My only concerns: Ma'a and the fact they'll play Toeava at 15 if Mils doesn't make it to Hong Kong

I want to see more Donald 10 Carter 12 bizz...

That way we can keep Ma'a as a utility. I reckon he is a second half man/impact player.

Toeava will be sweet Pete. He was the only one that stood out in AKL team when they've played. He just need to listen to what his coaches are telling him. Thats all.

I was a bit fucked off with Sivivatu being selected, but I'm ok with it now. I reckon both Rocs and Gear will put some pressure on him and we might see some magic from him. If not, who cares, cause the above two players will take that position very happily!

I'm fucking stoked with forwards too. Solid pack. They should have a lot of fun with slow NH loosies.

The Hong Kong game I reckon will be a cracker!

Good to see Corey Flynn in there, much deserved.

Team for the weekend

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Hosea Gear, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Dan Carter, 11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Stephen Donald, 9 Jimmy Cowan; 8 Rodney So'oialo, 7 Richie McCaw (c), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Neemia Tialata, 2 Andrew Hore, 1 Tony Woodcock. Reserves: 16 Keven Mealamu, 17 Greg Somerville, 18 Anthony Boric, 19 Adam Thomson, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Ma'a Nonu, 22 Isaia Toeava.

Oh yeah! Donald 10 Carter 12

Bring it bitches!

Mils is out on daddy duties. Toeava comes into 15, Cory Jane comes onto the bench. Final teams for the weekend:

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Isaia Toeava, 14 Hosea Gear, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Dan Carter, 11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Stephen Donald, 9 Jimmy Cowan; 8 Rodney So'oialo, 7 Richie McCaw (c), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Neemia Tialata, 2 Andrew Hore, 1 Tony Woodcock. Reserves: 16 Keven Mealamu, 17 Greg Somerville, 18 Anthony Boric, 19 Adam Thomson, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Ma'a Nonu, 22 Cory Jane.

AUSTRALIA: 15 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 14 Peter Hynes,13 Ryan Cross, 12 Stirling Mortlock (c), 11 Drew Mitchell, 10 Matt Giteau, 9 Luke Burgess, 8 Richard Brown, 7 George Smith, 6 Dean Mumm, 5 Nathan Sharpe, 4 Mark Chisholm, 3 Al Baxter, 2 Stephen Moore, 1 Benn Robinson. Reserves: 16 Adam Freier 17 Matt Dunning 18 Phil Waugh 19 David Pocock 20 Sam Cordingley 21 Berrick Barnes 22 Lachie Turner

We're going to destroy them

Only possible problem is rustiness!

...and the fact they're playing under Northern Hemisphere ELVs...

Not enough Aucklanders

AB's looked rusty as...

Apart from that, I think we should give Donald/Carter another shot.

Oh and wtf was up with that turf?!

You're joking right?

There's no point to it at all. Donald isn't fit to shine Carter's boots as far as 1st 5s go, as I said in another thread Donald is a good player but AB 1st 5s need to be exceptional at the very least. We just lose to much from Carter by moving him out, I'd be sceptical of this tactic even being wothwhile to accomodate a player of the quality of Evans or Spencer let alone fucking Donald. Dan Carter is too good to be movedn out of 10, plus the ABs looked so much better without Donald on the field.

Jono, can you tell me who are you going to play at 10 when Carter is gone o/seas? And how do you expect Donald to just fit into the team without any game time at 10?

Look, the bottom line is that I'm not arguing the fact that Carter is the best 10 in the world. But what I'm saying is that Donald needs game time in that position. There isn't another 1st 5/8 in the country that can play on this level.

I also think it's unfair to judge Donald's performance on just one game(not only any game, his first start!), against the 2nd/3rd best team in the world.

Yup totally agree Roman. Think your missing the whole point in Donald playing 10 Jono.Once Carter is on his sabbatical we have no-one to cover, hence Donald needing all the game time he can get.

There's no All Black rugby while Carter is on his sabbatical? He only misses the Super 14?

Maybe GH shouldn't be so dismissive of Lukey Mac...

That's what I was thinking too.

Carter will miss most of the tri-nations next year...

Teams for the weekend:

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Isaia Toeava, 14 Anthony Tuitavake, 13 Richard Kahui, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Joe Rokocoko, 10 Stephen Donald, 9 Piri Weepu; 8 Liam Messam, 7 Adam Thomson, 6 Kieran Read, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Anthony Boric, 3 John Afoa, 2 Keven Mealamu (c), 1 Jamie Mackintosh. Reserves: 16 Corey Flynn, 17 Neemia Tialata, 18 Ross Filipo, 19 Riche McCaw, 20 Andy Ellis, 21 Daniel Carter, 22 Cory Jane.

SCOTLAND: 15 Chris Paterson, 14 Thom Evans, Ben Cairns, Nick De Luca, 11 Sean Lamont, 10 Phil Godman, 9 Mike Blair (c), 8 Simon Taylor, 7 John Barclay, 6 Jason White, Jim Hamilton, 4 Nathan Hines, 3 Euan Murray, 2 Ross Ford, 1 Allan Jacobsen. Reserves: Dougie Hall, 17 Alasdair Dickinson, 18 Matt Mustchin, 19 Scott Gray, Rory Lawson/ Mark McMillan, 21 Dan Parks, 22 Hugo Southwell.

I like that team.

Scotland to be man-shamed...

Fast and powerful, right across both backs and forwards. We will eat them alive.

What time's the game on in NZ?

6.15 am

Thee is talk iin the UK of Scotland putting out a B team to save themselves for the saffas the next weekend

Which would be incredibly stupid if they do do that, for a start South Africa will also eat them alive...... and also I would have thought 2 consequtive tests vs arguably the worlds two top teams would be ideal for development

Rickey Flutey also making his debut for England this week, must be proud after growing up in Wellington dreaming of one day representing England.

Maestro, Scotland team, as from above, is the strongest team they could field.

lol Jono!

Sense has prevailed then


Riki is a Maori too....Im not sure if that should make it worse but for me it somehow does

Hope Read plays well, love to see him cement a spot over Kaino.

Yeah, you'd like that wouldn't you...

In all seriousness though, the more quality competition for one position the better. Players perform out of their skin and/if there is an injury, you know you have a quality replacement who can perform on that level.

Well nacoa, I thought Reid was solid as.

His Canterbury mate Ellis though... fucking hell, whats up with all the aimless kicking?

Kahui had a strong game.

Looks like Mils going straight into fullback after not playing for ages. I don't think it's right tbh. I reckon Toeava did really well and should get another chance with Mils to earn his spot back. Thats only fair.

Donald looked fucking average. He doesn't have any kicking game. One time he did kick, it was out on the full...

I was very much impressed with Weepu. He is what ABs needed at that messy breakdown. He is strong and could still get his passes away. When Ellis came on, he got completely owned by Scots pulling him and spoiling his deliveries.

Yeah pretty impressed, slotted well into lock too when Boric was off the field.

Messam had an alright game, few to many handling areas though.

Agree Weepu is the better half back.

I reckon wer should keep Kahui at centre too, think that is his best position IMO

Kahui is not a fucking winger! He is not quick enough, compare to what we have available anyways...

aside from a dodgy ref, Ellis is a large factor in us getting beaten at the RWC07.

he is and always has been, SHIT behind the breakdown.

Teams for the weekend:

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Joe Rokocoko, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Daniel Carter, 9 Jimmy Cowan; 8 Rodney So'oialo, 7 Richie McCaw (c), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Neemia Tialata, 2 Keven Mealamu, 1 Tony Woodcock. Reserves: 16 Corey Flynn, 17 John Afoa, 18 Anthony Boric, 19 Kieran Read, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Isaia Toeava.

IRELAND: 15 Girvan Dempsey, 14 Tommy Bowe, 13 Brian O'Driscoll (c), 12 Luke Fitzgerald, 11 Robert Kearney, 10 Ronan O'Gara, 9 Tomas O'Leary; 8 Jamie Heaslip, 7 David Wallace, 6 Alan Quinlan 5 Paul O'Connell, 4 Donncha O'Callaghan, 3 John Hayes, 2 Rory Best, 1 Marcus Horan. Reserves: 16 Jerry Flannery, 17 Tony Buckley, 18 Stephen Ferris, 19 Shane Jennings, 20 Eoin Reddan, 21 Paddy Wallace, 22 Keith Earls.

Just to add, there is no way in hell Irish will be beating the ABs with team like that. Sorry, maybe over confident, but I believe it is a current 1st XV. To me however, Tuitavake should be in place of Sivivatu.

I think the first XV is a combination of last weekend and this weekend's teams. Weepu over Cowan, Kahui over Smith, anyone over Nonu, anyone over Siti and perhaps Messam or Reid over Kaino.

Disagree with Weepu over Cowan. Weepu was more suitable for the game against Scots. He had a really good game. But, Cowan will be a better option for the backline we have this weekend (Carter at 1st 5/.

Don't underestimate Smith. His defensive work is great. Not only he defends well, he organizes defenses well.

As far as Messam goes, he will get his chances. Henry is going for experience for what looks like an experienced Irish forward pack.

Does anyone think we can win all the next 3 games? Northern Hemisphere are a lot stronger than they have been in recent times, especially Wales. England and Ireland are no easy beats either. I think we can pull it off, but it'll be something special. Mind you, the achievements this year are pretty incredible giving all the players we've lost.

Definitely like the side. Mils is a pure class player, he's up there with McCaw, Carter and Williams. You don't leave those sort of guys out if they're fit and available, even if they're a bit rusty.

Cowan to start with Piri off the bench is the right decision for me.

Need to see something from Sivivatu, and Nonu needs to string some good performances together.

They should win remaining matches with about the same score they did over Scotland (taking in consideration that unexperienced players were playing and Scotland are worse team then Ireland, England and Wales).

English will always be talking themselves up. Even if they had two players to field aged 6, they still be saying shit like " this time we will beat them" etc etc.

Irish had nothing. Nuff said.

Rough-around-the-edges AB performance

Best player on the field was the Irish #12, shame the other 14 guys were shit

Very enjoyable game, IMO. Very refreshing after last week as I was fairly sure sticking to Northern ELVs would ruin rugby.

Nonu showing he's got the ability to add some dimensions to his game too. Some decision making is still questionable but the flashes of brilliance made it worth it in this match.

Team to play Munster on Wednesday morning -

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Cory Jane, 14 Hosea Gear, 13 Anthony Tuitavake, 12 Isaia Toeava, 11 Joe Rokocoko, 10 Stephen Donald, 9 Piri Weepu (c); 8 Liam Messam, 7 Scott Waldrom, 6 Adam Thomson, 5 Jason Eaton, 4 Ross Filipo, 3 Ben Franks, 2 Corey Flynn, 1 Jamie Mackintosh. Reserves: 16 Hikawera Elliott, 17 John Afoa, 18 Brad Thorn, 19 Kieran Read, 20 Alby Mathewson, 21 Richard Kahui, 22 Mils Muliaina.

Wow, I don't think we could have picked a more inexperienced side!

Don't want to completely embarrass them though eh, especially at the opening of their new ground

Not sure what sort of team Munster will put out either to be honest. Most of their forward pack are on international duty.

It should be a walk over. 50+ points.

Enjoyed Nonu's performance against Ireland... I am actually starting to rate him now.

Woah anyone watching/listening to the Munster game this morning?

Crazy first half!!

Munster up 16-10 at half time.

haha definately not a 50 point walkover hahaha. all Blacks looking pretty average... especially at breakdown.. Thompson is nowhere and Waldrom is not even engaging in rucks..more just floating in midfield wanting to score....

Yeah, I've said that in the Lounge. Lol, they're giving young ABs a rugby lesson.

Yeah young guys really have their work cut out to pull this one back. Seems to be quite a scrappy game and with the heart Munster have at the moment could be a very close finish.

Although with some of the flair coming out from the ABs now we might get there!

First we need to get it to our flair dude. Donald isn't passing...

yup i agree. Im a big fan of Donald but today he is not on his game at all....


fuck can you imagine if Munster had their first string playing?

On that our entire backline has been pretty mud.

WORD!!!!

True. Let's not forget that they're European Champions.

I tell you what, this is the first game since the WC exit that is keeping me on the edge of my seat!

I hear that!!!!

FRIG that was close!!!!!!

Phew, what a good effort by Munster!

Well done to the young boys for holding them out. It will be a massive learning curve for all those debutantes.

Some pretty bad refereeing at times. Also some terrible ball handling from the ABs.

Yeah awesome effort by Munster.

And as you say coming away with a win from a tight scrappy game like that will help the young guys immensely.

fuck yeah.. jeeze i tell ya i had almost given up.. Agree with Messam getting MOTM. he played pretty well especially in that 2nd half.

Gutted i missed the hakas!!

PHEW!!

OMG Donald is sooo shit, he was below par before this game but now he's just takin' the piss. Possibly the most inept AB 1st 5 I've ever seen.

Messam, you absolute beast. Been talking him up for time and what a display of power, pace and skill he put on today. I hope he starts against England or Wales.

Tucks, hakas were awesome. Kiwi boys from Munster side stepped up and went hard! Howlett was so passionate. heh. It must off been weird being on the receiving side of the haka for both sides!

Team for the weekend against Wales:

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Joe Rokocoko, 13 Richard Kahui, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Daniel Carter, 9 Jimmy Cowan; 8 Rodney So'oialo, 7 Richie McCaw (c), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Neemia Tialata/ John Afoa 2 Keven Mealamu, 1 Tony Woodcock/ Tialata/ Afoa. Reserves: 16 Corey Flynn, 17 TBC, 18 Anthony Boric, 19 Kieran Read, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Isaia Toeava.

Looks good. Although I'm not a big fan of Sivivatu, he has made more of his time in black jersey.

I'm a little disappointing that Gear had failed to step it up.

Donald

Do we have anyone other than Donald? :-/

I think we've shown so far that we can cope just fine with the player drain at international level. Maybe not once DC is on sabbatical though.

Has Mils ever been tried at first five? It'd be xlnt for the Blues. Might be a bit hard to teach an old dog new tricks now though. He certainly has the ball skill and kicking talents.

I miss Nick Evans

Mils is a Chief PFunk.

Donald isnt that bad. He is still very young as a rugby player. Give him a bit of time.

Gotta get Evans or McCalister back.

How good has Stephen Brett played lately? Or is he not really a 1st 5? ...maybe that really young dude who was playing for Cuntebury?

Donald is ok. I think he just closes off when it comes to big games and starts to run instead of passing. Give him some time. Trust me, I do that first couple of games of the season too - ie not hearing the calls, not passing the ball, run it up myself etc. Adrenaline is through the roof. Couple games out of the way and I start seeing space, hearing people's voices etc. Hence pre-season games are important. Now imagine playing in the front of thousands of people. That adrenaline and pressure is massive!

Canterbury seem to have plenty of talent coming through in that department anyways (1st 5/8 that is). Colin Slade and Hamish Gard are both quality players. Brett in my opinion is not a 1st 5/8 material, a 2 5/8 more likely.

CHCH Boys High produces awesome 1st 5s, Mehrtans, Carter, Brett and Slade....

Brett has lost a bit of form and confidence since being injured and Slade is a bit fresh IMO

Good to see Kahui in there, now all we need now is read

McCalister wants to come back. Will be great to have another classy option at 1st/2nd.

Actually I was going to ask about Brett, was he not selected or injured?

Not selected for the domestic seasons (IIRC? Junior Blacks or something though) and injured for most of the ANZC so no chance to stake a claim for a spot.

I really dont rate Mcallistar that highly tbh.

Well in that case I would see Brett as the best understudy for Carter, he has more raw talent than any of the other contenders. Being a Crusader he's used to winning, and also seems to be following the Carter/Giteau route of playing a lot of second five early on in his career.

Potential to be the best second-five in the world. Not suited to full-time first five, IMO.

2011 RWC Backline will be DC10, Lukey Mac12, Sonny-Bill13.

Fear. That.

2005 NPC Auckland backline was Lavea 10, Sammy T 12, and Ben Atiga 13. Fear that.

Would be a good thing to see. But Mcallister def not a 1st 5.

'sif fearing 2 rugby players who are shorter than me

Well unlike Lukey Mac they actually won something :>

heh, watched lavea in a league match the other day. Would of been awesome if he stuck with that code

Yeah, I hear a lot of good stuff about Lavea's ability to play the other code.

I guess having a 20m punt isn't as crippling for a standoff as it is for a 1st 5.

Ha? I don't get it Jono...

Whatever shortcomings he had didn't stop him winning multiple NPC titles, did they?

Oh Lavea, got it.

Caleb Ralph won multiple Super 12s... Your point?

ABs run the ball at an injured player It's a win but what an ignoble one.

The #10 is the most important player on the field.

The job of the #10 is to win games. Lavea won games. EOT.

I was unimpressed with that and so were the crowd. It was up to the referee to stop play though, which I thought he was bound to do.

Far too many errors for both sides - bit of a boring game.

We still haven't conceded a point in the second half on this tour

It was an awesome game. Not too many mistakes, the scrums were an annoyance but that's usualy.

Byrne - the Welsh 15 - is fucking awesome. Someone sign him to come play for Auckland!

Ref can't stop the game because of an injury. Unless its serious and he can see that the player is knocked out or something. Welsh trainers made a big deal out of nothing. Yeah, the player did get injured, but it wasn't as bad as they made it out to look. Ref did the right thing and carried on with the game, because teams are known to do this sort of stuff to stop momentum of the attacking team.

The game was boring. The handling was shocking!

I reckon Nonu has been the most improved player in NZ squad so far.

I quite enjoyed the game, ok it wasn't fluent, but the Welsh played well. I wonder how different the game would've been if they'd scored a try in the first half (as they almost did a couple of times).

WTF was up with Jimmy Cowan? Does he not know how to feed a scrum properly? It was shocking and the worst thing was he kept doing it after the ref pinged him for it. Which is the verry definition of stupidity.

Apparently it was miscommunication/understanding between Cowan and ABs front row. They pushed too early or something like that...

I was at the game in Cardiff, and for me it was hugely memorable, but moreso for reasons other than the rugby. It was a win, the first half was forgettable, the second half showed occasional moments of NZ brilliance, intertwined with excessive errors and penalties.

The highlight: the atmosphere. It was like nothing I've ever experienced in New Zealand, and to be realistic, will probably ever experience. The attitude of the Welsh fans towards their underdog side, the epic noise created by their singing and chanting; not beautiful, not or elegant, just an overwhelming cacophony of noise supporting them, reaching its climax when the Welsh side stood up to the haka. It was beyond words, and could've easily played a role in why the All Blacks seemed unsettled for much of the game. All of this, in a true world-class stadium of 75,000 people with the root shut, it was a cauldron of fever-pitch Welsh pride. Fucking awesome.

I really wish for a stadium like that in Auckland, somewhere that isn't Eden Park, but I don't ever see it happening.

Atmosphere looked awesome. Game as usual was a bumbling mess of dropped balls and knock ons. If the ABs could get there shit together they could destroy these teams.

We could have had one!


A few of the features of the Waterfront Stadium was that A: it was to have retractable stands to expand he pitch for cricket and B: to have a closable roof.


The New Carrisbrook stadium is going to have a closable roof as well. It makes a HUGE difference to the atmosphere.

That'll be great if there are any rugby players left in Otago by the time it's finished